Dean is first.  Oops, I said it again.

judy's busy on the previous thread, but I can't post in a visible place.

It's my sense that the verbal assaults on Iran are designed as a cover for introducing missiles into Iraq.  And then, of course, there was the argument that our presence in Iraq is made necessary by the need to protect them from their neighbors--a story that's now been given the lie by their friendly meetings with Iran. Syria has been somewhat less friendly, but only because they've apparently run out of room to accommodate more refugees and have closed the borders to slow the flow. 

Thanks, Monica, for trying ... it seems like all my posts on the last thread are at the bottom. I did scroll up to see your notice!

I'll also go back and post the link since it may perhaps fall at the end.

One would think that such a thing as sequencing would be fairly easy to adjust for, especially since it worked just fine in all previous BFA iterations.

Sigh.

And yes, Tom, Dean is first! Absolutely!

I am happy to report that the link landed where it should have ... I was apparently the designated last poster.

********
Jeff, thank you for writing about this! I totally agree. But this bunch of criminal screw-ups has no scruples, knows no bounds and has a Congress that it has no reason to respect since Congress still refuses to fill its mandated role when high crimes and misdemeanors are afoot.

So things do not bode well for the next few months.

********
Because I am beginning to get very depressed, I am leaving for now, but will link you to DU's wonderful EarlG, who is consistently able to take some very sour lemons (indeed!), to make some passable lemonade, which does raise the spirit a bit.

Hope that you all have a nice day!

=========
The Top 10 Conservative Idiots, No. 330
March 24, 2008
With Friends Like These Edition

This week John McCain (1,3) and Joe Lieberman (2,3) spend some quality time together, Tucker Carlson (4) and John Gibson (5) get the axe, and George W. Bush (6) celebrates the Iraq War's fifth anniversary. Don't forget the key!

[...]
http://www.democraticunderground.com/dis...

I think, Jeff, that the key to getting out of Iraq is shutting down the Air Force bases, which are, after all, what the combat troops are "protecting" from mortars and shells.  That and the supply lines, mostly for fuel, which are being continually planted with IEDs.

I was particularly distressed by Senator Clinton's elaboration of the civil war theme in her speech on Iraq.  Let me fetch a sample from Hannah--

But the point of the surge was to give the Iraqis the time and space for political reconciliation.

If she were honest, she would admit that the 'reconciliation' involves Iraqis accepting a long-term U.S. presence on bases, islands of death that have been plopped down in their midst.  The formulation resembles nothing so much as a determined parent putting a recalcitrant child in time-out.

Yet today, the Iraqi government has failed to provide basic services for its citizens.

What sense would it make to rebuild not just what the U.S. has destroyed, but what is likely to be destroyed again in the 'continuous bombardment' that both the participants in the Helsinki Agreement and the Air Force in its weekly summary of actions admits?  Not to mention that there's no logical connection between politics and sewers, except in the minds of people who still seem to think that stressing the population will cause the government to collapse.  It's as if the lesson of Dresden, which is universally recognized as over-kill, had made no impression.  Unless, failure is the desired outcome. 

They have yet to pass legislation ensuring the equitable distribution of oil revenues, yet even to pass a law setting the date of provincial elections.

What legal basis there is for ordering a sovereign nation to adopt particular legislation is a question that should be asked.  Iraq, under the direction of Saddam Hussein, had taken offensive action against Kuwait which merited some penalty (disarmament, embargo, no-fly zones).  However, since those penalties were complied with and Saddam Hussein is now gone, the fact that there's resistance to an occupation by people who, sometimes, refer to themselves as alQaeda in Iraq, does not make the continued occupation legitimate.  That the U.N. hasn't quite figured out how to get the bully out, isn't a proper reason either.  Finally, while the law may be stretched to make something appear legal to the world community, the occupation is immoral.

Corruption and dysfunction is rampant,

This is a good example of not telling the whole truth.  The Iraqi puppets may be corrupt (it's what the U.S. has been aiming for), but the majority of the money being spent corruptly and for no good purpose is being spent by the U.S.  By failing to be specific, the Senator presents a partial truth to perpetrate a lie. 

and last week General Petraeus himself conceded that no one, in either the U.S. government or the Iraqi government, feels that there has been sufficient progress by any means in the area of national reconciliation.

The significance of a concession by an American general escapes me.  Certainly there's no reason to expect an objective assessment from him; nor should we consider the "feelings" being referenced determinative of anything.  Would it be more accurate to state that the Iraqis are no closer to being reconciled to the presence of forces that have displaced and killed a fifth of the population?  Definitely.  But that would be the truth and the Senator is long past the point where the truth of this land-grab can be admitted by her.  The time to do that would have been before the authorization to use force to claim what Saddam Hussein had refused to give up.  Now, after five years, her investment in the fiction is such that she can't come clean. 

Some people are trying---

As the war in Iraq heads toward its two year anniversary, General Merrill (Tony) McPeak is not optimistic about a positive outcome. In part two of our interview with General McPeak, he responds to Senator McCain’s recent comments that suggest America might have troops in Iraq for decades and that the public would accept such a scenario if casualties are brought to a minimum.

General McPeak: Sure, we’ve been in Korea since the 1950’s, almost a half century and we’ve been in Germany since 1945 and we’ve been in Japan. The American people have shown they are willing to station troops overseas but they haven’t shown they are willing to conduct a 50-year counter-insurgency. In fact, Vietnam lasted ten years and what we ran out of there was time. The American people ran out of patience. Marshall said that no democracy can fight a ten-year war. I’m not sure he’s accurate but the fuse started burning on Vietnam after Walter Cronkite came back from visiting and said ‘your government is not telling you the truth about what is going on.’

my LTE for today--

4000

good morning all!  well, at least this (the last) thread was pro-Hillary rather than anti-Obama.  must be they're feeling desperate, if they're bothering to come here, to this broken little blog.  what Hillary's supporters can't seem to get thru their heads is that we DO know Hillary - we've been following her very closely for years now  and that it's her own actions as much as the hope of Obama that has driven many of us away from her, that warn us that she and the folks she would bring to the WH would be bad for the country.

environmrntally blue - most of us here at BFA support Howard Dean's 50 state strategy.  Hillary & Company have been tryingto undermine that strategy and doing the same old 'ignore half the country and go for that handful of states' thingy that they've been losing elections with for years now.  Hillary doesn't think the states she lost 'count', they weren't 'part of her game plan'.  well that sounds an awful lot like what we've had from George Bush when it comes to 'presidentin' - pander to his base and to heck with the rest of the country.

I guess the thing that irritates me most is that Hillary is getting a pass that NONE of the other candidates would have gotten - if she were in Obama's shoes right now, she would have been crowned the winner weeks ago and Obama would be off the campaign trail and back in the Senate.  Hillary ghas gotten just enough life support from the corpmediawhores who want to keep this thing going long after the truth has surfaced.  short of kneecapping Obama, she has already lost the election - she can't 'win' it, she can only advance by default.  and she's ready and willing to 'default' him, regardless the fallout to the party.

Hillary, for all the good she may have done over the years, has made this bed herself.  she decided HOW to run her campaign, so now she has to live with it.  I thnk her biggest mistake was underestimating the intelligence of the average American these days.  oh and she forgot that we can get to the facts, the history of her own words, so much easier now with the internet.  I've lost all trust and respect for HRC - and it wasn't Obama who led me to this, it was HRC herself.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

well said

If you would follow Hillary Clinton from event to event you may well find her a candidate you could support, an anti-war, anti-NAFTA, populist on the stump

You would have to be following the whole campaign of the viscious attacks on Howard Dean, and Barack Obama, (even Bill Richardson), and have an understanding of her backers (who she owes, in an old style way), and her electability argument of playing the very narrow electoral college game to get the larger picture.

and you would have to believe that BUSH CLINTON CLINTON BUSH BUSH CLINTON is change 

she has simply made a bargin with too many devils to get where she is right now to be the name opposite Democratic Party and not one of them has to do with her gender which is where she gets the support that brought her this far

FRED from Ashland:
 
I don't want this discussion to drag on forever, so I'll try to make my comments brief.
 
Regarding Arabs in the Israeli Knesset: I believe there are currently 10 Arab MKs, 1 of whom is a member of the Labor Party. (There is also 1 Druze MK, and 17 MKs are women. How many women and non-Muslim legislators do you suppose there are there in the Arab world?)
 
As for non-Jewish immgration: as of May 2006, Israel had 306,000 immigrants (approx. 4% of the population) who were not classified as Jewish.
 
Last thing: if you believe that if Israel were more like an American democracy, it would be a great nation living in peace, you're looking at a different planet than I am. From the time Jewish immigration started 100 years ago, Arabs were killing Jewish civilians. And not just in Palestine/Israel. Yasir Arafat's cousin, the infamous Mufti (religious leader) Haj Amin el-Husseini was personally responsible for deporting 10,000 Jewish civilians to Auschwitz. Arafat never condemned or repudiated this. During World War II, the nascent Arab states sided with the Nazis. While Germany has bent over backwards to atone for what they did, one cannot say the same for Israel's neighbors.
 
So yes, Israeli actions are sometimes over the top (as happens everywhere). But considering that they're surrounded and outnumbered 36 to 1 by people who have been screaming for their blood since long before the 1967 war, it can be hard not to overreact.

From the Sacramento Bee Capitol AM Alert

The Assembly Transportation Committee is set to take up Assemblyman Chuck DeVore's AB 1940 to qualify pregnant women for "temporarily disabled" parking placards, as well as Assemblyman Gene Mullin's AB 2107 to restrict habitual truants from obtaining driver's licenses.

Outside the Capitol, Sen. John McCain is set for a two-day campaign swing through California.

He's scheduled for a visit today to a VFW hall in Chula Vista, and an appearance Tuesday at the Orange County Hispanic Small Business Roundtable in Santa Ana.

OK, what's a Monday without a photo of Hitler?  Thanks?  Maybe not.

Anyhow, the real reason for my post is that it seems to me that Bill Clinton's campaign for the presidency has clearly overshadowed his wife's.  In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if he pushes her right off the stage the next time they appear together.

The media no longer even pretends that it isn't a co-campaign.  John King on Bill Press's show referred to them as "The Clintons."  The Clintons said this, the Clintons promised that.

Bill Clinton went on record as saying that the 22nd amendment should be modified.  He wants a 2 term president to be able to run for another 1/2 term.  And then another, only he wants the bigger half.

back from chincoteague. how you all doing? is it still all about hillary?

Time to take the makeup case and go home hillary. you tried but we want someone new.

mccain is too old and you have been around too long.

nite.

donna in evanston:

OK, no more pics of Htler. How about a pic of a nice kitty cat?

A bit of a reprise--

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/3/24/82755/3934/1011/483075 

hi Phil - thanks for the comments and I caught the Howardly yesterday - it is much appreciated!  how did your weekend go - did you have a good turnout?  or was that meeting for this week?  I'm havng a hard time keeping track of time lately!

there's only one thing that I'm certain of in this election season: it ain't gonna be dull...

aw jeez - shootings and a mnahunt going on at Univ of Iowa campus - is in lockdown - have given description of shooter and his vehicle.

Beautiful kitty Bob.

I'm not as gifted as you guys in writing.  This is simply how I feel about previous thread.  I've already seen HRCs accomplishments, 4000 Americans killed in a war she voted for, she trusted GWB, she did not read security report, she used very bad judgement, yeah I really want her to answer the phone at 3AM. 

environmentally blue - what was published that endangered you, that's 'private' or 'personal'?  your monniker, which is anonymous and your zip code, both of which you supplied to sign up to write a thread on bfa.  so how is that hurting you?  when you register with a website you should read the terms of use and privacy info for that site - if you provide info that is viewable on the website, then you are giving your permission for it to be seen there.  no one provided your address or phone number or email addy, which WOULD have been a privacy issue.  YOU provided the info which was posted on the blog. 

but then, of course, this might be a privacy issue because your name is listed in the Miami phonebook as 'environmentally blue'.  in that case I would say you need more than just a quick course in protecting your own identity.

Hillary supports the 50 state strategy - lol, lol, lol!!!!!!!! 

and rae, I enjoy your writing! 

environmentally wrote "Obama is destroying Howard's 50 state strategy, the voice of the people and the voters in Florida and Michigan . . ."

How did Florida and Michigan come to be the 50 states?  If you want to locate opponents of the 50 state strategy, look at the Clinton campaign's finance chairman and Dean's predecessor, Terry McAuliffe.  Dean's biggest job after succeeding McAuliffe was to actually go and find Democrats outside of the 18 blue states because McAuliffe relied exclusively on a plan to cobble together a coalition of big donors in states with large Democratic majorities on both coasts and in the upper midwest while ignoring flyover country. 

He has a few, well recognized colleagues who are philosophically compatible, including stout Clinton defenders Carville, Begala, Schumer and the deeply conflicted Emanuel.  The press has certainly not kept this a secret.

New thread.

False alarm.  I hit the wrong link.  The new thread is planned for 11.  Sorry.

11.

Bob (NJ for Democracy)
Mon, 03/24/08

...So yes, Israeli actions are sometimes over the top (as happens everywhere). But considering that they're surrounded and outnumbered 36 to 1 by people who have been screaming for their blood since long before the 1967 war, it can be hard not to overreact.
----------------

Bob, your arguments (especially photo you’ve posted) may sound and look quite convincing, however there are some other arguments too that belongs to very same Jewish people as well.
They are in small number so far which IS getting larger and larger every day (much in the same way as the number of Americans who opposes the Iraq war today).

You may want to take a look at views and stances of these Jews as well to realize that almost diametrical to yours, the opposite ones do exist and it is viable.

You, of course, can disregard, denounce, reject those people and their positions, or call them traitors, etc. however it will not make them and their stances to disappear.

You are welcome, it is here: http://www.nkusa.org/

Bob (NJ for Democracy)
Mon, 03/24/08

...So yes, Israeli actions are sometimes over the top (as happens everywhere).

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

No Bob......your biased posts deserve a rapid response........the British could have handled IRA "TERRORISTS" differantly.........but they didnt..the result........peace.......maybe you should give it a try..........of course, England isnt continually building "illegal" settlements on Irish soil..........

environmentally wrote "Are you one of the Obama supporters that were talking of hunting down Hillary supporters to hurt them personally? . . . Reminds me of the Charles Manson crowd."

Your posts are bordering on hysteria.  Is this representative of the prevailing mood on the gas-filled Hindenburg that is now the Clinton campaign?

environmentally blue, I feel like we already had the class and you showed up a day late expecting us to catch you up. I really don't feel like sitting here and refuting the points you are making above b/c we've already argued them, linked them, supported them, to the point we've made enemies of erstwhile friends and lost some good contributors in the process. So I say, who is paying you to blog here anyway? And do you like kitties or doggies? And i agree with you about the personal info on the blog.

There's a new thread - when they fix the sequencing, maybe they can give us a five minute warning on new threads? Just a thot.

envblue - you need to take off your tinfoil hat - and you may as well stop trying to paint me as a terrorist because your conspiracy crap won't fly here.  in addition to being blogging friends, many of us personally know each other on this blog.  as I said before, IF your personal information was printed on the blog, that would have been a serious privacy issue.  it wasn't, you just want to fight with someone about something here and now you're trying to paint me as someone who has threatened others.  I have never done so and you should be very careful about writing such slander on any blog.  no joke about that.

Unless Senator Clinton wins an average of over 65% of the votes in the final ten contests, she cannot catch Senator Obama. That is just simply the math of the situation - so, environmentally blue is near the end of her transformation to just plain "blue".

 Here is my most recent LTE - available for observation and reasonable comments :

There are many very good reasons why Senator Barack Obama is better suited
for the White House than Senator John McCain or Senator Hillary Clinton. The
recent news about Reverend Wright's incendiary statements about America and
9/11 speak very clearly to this.

Senator Clinton's style of slash-and-burn-politics, "blaming everyone else
for her failings except herself", and drawing a line in the sand between
herself and anyone who disagrees with her is very similar to Reverend
Wright's style. With both of them, there is no dialogue with anyone who
disagrees - and a clear "my way or no one else's" approach.

The "straight-talk" Senator McCain of 2000 disavowed the so-called
right-wing ministers like John Hagee ( who has called the Catholic Church a
"cult" ) and Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell ( who have since blamed 9/11 on
feminists, lesbians and gays ). The 2008 "waffling" John McCain has kissed
up to these same ministers - whose rhetoric is just as vile as Reverend
Wright's - in order to earn their endorsement.

Senator Obama has a clearly different manner of dealing with problems
confronting America than the manner of Senator Clinton, Senator McCain,
Reverend Wright, Reverend Hagee, Reverend Falwell and Reverend Robertson. He
finds common ground on issues with people across the political spectrum by
conducting reasonal and respectful dialogue with them - and then sets out to
find solutions that everyone can find agreement on.

environmentally blue - with all due respect, you need to get a grip.

I just have to ask the following "loaded" question of environmentally blue :

Do I also know you as "Trixie" ? Just curious . . . . . . .

Good heavens, "Blue".

Obama has a clear path to a majority decision with the earned delegates - and major momentum with the delegates-at-large - AND increasing numbers of major endorsements ( even from people like Bill Richardson, who the Clintons thought they had in their pocket ).

All these positive trends - and you claim that we Obama supporters are "desperate". Sounds like something James Carville would say.

What are your thoughts on his "30 pieces" remark ? Has he become incidental and unimportant - like all those states which Senator Clinton "didn't count on or expect to win anyway" ?

lol! re: Thank you for pointing this out. Maybe you should let more know so they don't venture here. But then again, this is a PAC and they accept contributions based on that, advertise themself as such. So I think you must be in the wrong place if that's all this is to you. Maybe you should take that type of frienship offline or from public commenting.

the reason we KNOW each other is because we are INVOLVED in politics - we don't just blog, we're active in every imaginable way, and thus many of us met up with each other in order to get a pregressive elected in 2004 (Howard Dean, you know, the guy whose blog this is?) and are working to do so once again - sorry, Hillary didn't make the cut when we voted for who the most progressive candidates were - she dissed us completely because she doesn't like us very much.  if didn't know that, just ask her staff what the Clintons think of Dean and all the grassroots he sprouted.  Hill and the DLC had a lot to do with the negative and slanderous attacks on Howard when he was running - remember the sad where Dean's face was morphed into Obama's?  so here on this blog we are very aware of their tactics.  do your homework, then come on back and maybe we can have an educated conversation.

ewwww - pregressive s/b prOgressive!

environmentally blue,

Keep telling yourself that, spin all you want, maybe you will have a clearer conscience.  HRC gave Bush authorization to go to war.  Sure so did alot of other people, but that is no excuse.  She still used bad judgement.  She did not read the security reports.  She cannot be trusted.

13.

Bob (NJ for Democracy)
Mon, 03/24/08

My Dad had a cat who had similar markings. He had these big round eyes. We called him Charlie because we thought he looked like Charlie Chaplin.