Dean is first.  Thank you for your cooperation.

Burning Down the House

http://www.rhapsody.com/talkingheads/stopmakingsense/burningdownthehouse 

Thank you, Danny.  My 2 cents, FWIW.

I agree with mary vb.  When Hill talks policy and about her experience and what she's done to help others, she's superb.

BO obviously knew next to nothing about Putin's successor.  He changed the subject quickly.

He doesn't have the foreign policy knowledge that she has.  That's clear.  

I like it when she's cheeky.  I like all women who don't *behave* well.  They don't make history.  I like it when she spoofs him.

Yes, Karen, we heard the same debate, but I was hearing it w/o the Obamania filter.  :-) 

She won, IMO, but perhaps not enuf to stop the advancing waves of adoring supporters.  

He did OK, but the word ambivalent came up and that's the word I've been looking for.  He doesn't seem to take strong stands and now he's hedging on the public funding issue .. wants to wait and talk with McCain.  This feels unclean to me. 

Questions were lightweights.  I wanted to hear about the unitary executive and the Constitution.

Dodd could be an excellent choice for VP. 

Broken record? Me?  BO was plagerizing his own past speeches tonight.  LOL

I watched this debate just in case Hillary had a core meltdown and went up in a big orange mushroom cloud. But it didn't happen. She swiped at Obama a few times, but not only did he brush aside her criticisms, he used used them as an effective springboard to launch his own of her.

And Hillary just looked bad when she complained about always being called on first. Back when she was the inevitable nominee she loved getting to go first and most often.

I was glad that Barak told her if she wants to brag about her "experience" she has to take responsibility for the negative baggage of that "experience."

That is at the core of why many of us here have shied away from her.

IMO in retrospect, she would have been much better off had she never boasted of ever being in the White House, and if Bill had not helped her campaign.

From last thread....posted just as the thread changed.

Some snark about Carville.  He is so irritating.   He has no idea why there is such a huge primary turnout.   Just clueless.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1860

 Maybe that living room of theirs just hurts his thinking processes.

now he's hedging on the public funding issue .. wants to wait and talk with McCain.  This feels unclean to me. 

seashell~ His language has been clear and consistent. That he will "aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election." He hasn't gone back on that.

Go back to the last thread and read The Washington Post debate fact check .

There's a lot more important issues to talk about than knit picking over this, imo.

Good morning, BFA! Am heading back into the salt mines for the first time in a long time this am so won't be long.

*******
Obviously, I didn't watch last night's debate in real time so have to go with the recaps. Good job, Danny, for posting int'l coverage.

Am still chuckling over the Karen-Denise exchange on Hill's behavior being erotic versus erratic. LOL ... the visions that conjured up.

Was also delighted to see that DFA will be having a training session in Missoula, MT in May. The Dean Bros' 50-state strategy at work ... and more power to them. Of course, Missoula is, generally speaking, pretty safe *blue territory* even in a red state. I remember hearing heated exchanges during my youth about the *godless libruls* in Missoula, mostly due to the presence of the University of Montana, which at the time was known as Montana State University and was then the only *university* in the state.

Now there are other state (and private) schools with the *university* designation; the current *Montana State University,* for example, is the former *Montana State College* and is located in Bozeman. It used to be the *aggie* school. But Missoula was the first university in MT.

Lucky for me, I'll be there for a bit this summer, but a bit later timewise.

Since Danny has already posted several of my usual sources and I need to get going, I'll just post this one and one from the WaPo's Dan Froomkin.

For Gore crushies ... I knew about Lausanne, courtesy of Linda NM, but now I hear that we in Geneva will also be favored by a visit that is even earlier.

==============
Al Gore visits Lake Geneva region

The former US vice-president and Nobel Prize winner, visiting Lausanne in April to pick up an honorary degree, also travels to Geneva next month to talk "sustainable" business.

[...]
http://www.tdg.ch/pages/home/tribune_de_...(contenu)/198389

And here's Dan Froomkin's usual gem of a news round-up ...

==============
Bush: Clueless and Happy
By Dan Froomkin
Special to washingtonpost.com
Tuesday, February 26, 2008; 1:16 PM

President Bush last night delivered a buoyant campaign-style address to the 2008 Republican Governors Association Gala, once again raising the question of whether he has any idea what a drag he'll be on the Republican ticket.

Bush told big party donors that he is optimistic about the GOP's prospects -- as well as the verdict of history. "I don't know about you," he said, "but I'm confident we'll hold the White House in 2008. . . .

"Our ideas are those embraced by the American people. American people want strong national defense and they want the government to protect the people from further attack, and that's precisely what Republicans will give them. Americans want lower taxes and less government, and it's precisely what Republicans will give them. Americans want strong, principled leadership, and that is precisely what Republicans will give them.

"And so when I say I'm confident, I am so because I understand the mentality of the American people."

[...]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

Now gone ... but I leave you all with a disquieting thought that SHOULD concern every one of us:

Where is Karl Rove these days and just what is he up to?

********
Otherwise, have good ones.

JudyforDean:  Rove is now a talking/scheming head on Faux Gnus.  He'll have pretty much a bully pulpit to smear the dem cand.

now gone.  Happys, everyone. 

Thank you for voting.
Who do you think won the debate?
Clinton
152
(12.04%)
Obama
1110
(87.96%)

(OHIO)
http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...

Who won the latest Democratic debate?Hillary Clinton 1873 (36.4%)
Barack Obama 2674 (51.9%)
It was a toss up. 600 (11.7%)

http://news.aol.com/political-machine/20...


Who won Tuesday night's debate? Hillary Clinton 14
26%
Barack Obama 37
70%
Too close to call 2
4%
Total Votes: 53

(TEXAS)
http://www.star-telegram.com/388/story/4...

Good morning, everybody

Well, I tried to stay up and follow the debate on KOS, but it didn't seem riveting and it seems not to have held attention here either.

Is that really a picture of Carville's living room?  Looks like a cat house.

Caught John McCain's appology over Cunningham and noted his pledge that he would refer to the Democrats as "Senator."  I think that "Shame on you, Barack Obama" is going to be the turning point.  Not the word "shame" so much as the use of his name to castigate him.  So like an angry mother.

It seems the argument was over the word "boon" and whether or not that means the same as "good."  She said NAFTA as good; the flyer said she called it a "boon." 

Speaking of NAFTA, I've been wondering what they were thinking--

Wonder if the allusion was intentional and now accounts for the double disappointment. 

the Unions had it right at the time calling it SHAFTA

"30. Denise
Tue, 02/26/08

Reply to this

Hey mainefem, rent a car, drive down to Burlington and do in ten minutes what will take them months to do, and be sure they pay you (of course!). All expenses, car rental and your services. DFA would save money and maybe by the time the software is fixed people might actually still be here."

SoapBlox can have something up (a REAL BLOG) within 24 hrs., Denise.

Yes, I said 24 hrs.

Blue State Digital has been f^cking up this s0-called "portal" for yrs. (and has been creaming off big $$$ for doing so--utter incompetence).

Enough.

Can 'em.

Read the FEC reports, folks.

This piece of sh^t is beyond pathetic (as will anything else that HQ's so -called "IT people" crank out).

SoapBlox folks can do it in a jiffy; and for peanuts.

It might actually *work*!

Horrors.

http://tinyurl.com/3y3ekq

"Start yours today
Learn how to Start your SoapBlox today. Most sites can be up and running within 24-hours."

[....]

Yes, 24 hrs., you read that correctly, people.

http://tinyurl.com/34h9w6

Wake up, HQ.

It's 2008.

Gawd, my mother used Fels-Naptha up until her death.

Talk about an old-timer Mainah (Rethug housewife, w/a major case of OCD).

Yessuh.

I had buffering nightmares with the live feed so I went to bed and caught most of it with clips since.

my take is that Hillary is very poorly served by her team prep with the phoney one liners, when she gets into the meat of an answer and is just the very well prepared Senator speaking off the top of her head, she knows her stuff and has good instincts and I do wonder how good a candidate she could be with a do-over and a different team

Obama should have answered every last question as to whether or not he is Presidential material on any checklist

there they are; let the voters decide

In response to one of my comments on KOS somebody wondered what Hillary Clinton could do once Barack Obama has set his campaign.  In response, I came up with the following:

it's what she shouldn't have done.  She shouldn't have taken credit for things she didn't accomplish.  She shouldn't have appealed to the past and promised a restoration of an era that's been, if nothing else, tarnished by subsequent developments.  She shouldn't have forgotten that elections are about the voters and the will of the people.  She shouldn't have tried to transform a competition (multiple individuals striving for a common goal) into a contest (opponents trying to knock each other out).  She shouldn't have looked on the grass roots as just a new source of funds.  She shouldn't have tried to lecture voters on what's best for them.  She shouldn't have painted herself as Joan of Arc.  She should have avoided using the subjunctive in talking about the future because "I would, if I could" leads to the conclusion that "I won't."

Finally, it's my guess that Hillary Clinton doesn't have a very high opinion of men.  She's apparently not able, like that character in "As Good As It Gets," to make someone a better person.

Danny - gold star for your debate threads. Good job. It's great that the blog seems no longer on autopilot.

I wonder if Rove or Cheney has seen that living room. It sort of reminds me of a theatrical stage set for a production of "The Unsinkable Molly Brown" or "Funny Girl".


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Unsinka...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funny_Girl_...(film)

Sometimes I wonder if all these people are stuck in Mikey time-warp.  You know that ad--"Try it you'll like it, Mikey" and then the (what?) two-year old does.  Some new sugar-coated cereal?

I'm at a real disadvantage with commercials because I always try not to pay attention to them.  LOL 

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-chec...

'As I noted here, Obama is equivocating on what appeared to be a firm pledge to participate in public financing in the general election if his GOP rival does the same.'

-- from the Wash Post 'Fact Check'

but when you go to his link, it seems to back up what Obama has been saying on the subject

'In a Feb. 1, 2007 letter to the FEC, lawyers for Obama asked whether the campaign could "provisionally raise funds for the general election but retain the option" of returning the contributions if an agreement was reached with other major candidates on accepting public financing. The FEC ruled on March 1 that this was permissable, as long as the general election funds were kept in a clearly separate account from the primary election funds.

The Obama campaign is correct in arguing that there is nothing in the Feb. 1 letter to the FEC that can be fairly interpreted as committing the campaign to accepting public financing. Obama spokesman Bill Burton told Politico on Feb. 28, 2007 that the senator would not necessarily commit himself to participating in the public financing system if the commission approved his proposal. "It would be a situation where if the Republican agreed to opt-in to the public financing system, it would be something we would explore," Burton told Politico.'

+++++++++

I missed the debate due to 'buffering' so am relying on other sources -- I was bothered by comments that Obama was 'equivocating' on the financing. I'm now satisfied he is being consistent as usual.

_NYT_'s interactive debate coverage (if you can stomach it):

http://tinyurl.com/2cd444

Waste of my time, thanks.

Hillary is "erotic" toast (day old moldy bread).

BTW, I loved the Senator's observation that he didn't think the release of the photo of him in Somali garb was designed to promote his campaign.  Since he wasn't too keen about the distribution of the photo of him in swimming trunks, one might conclude that he's sensitive about how much clothing he's got on.  Which is why the reference to that photo of him as "dressed" was intended to hit a sore spot.  But, he seems rather unflappable.  That's a matter of temperament.

My spouse is one of those people who can never be insulted, although he's sometimes insulting.  When people are rude, he tends to become overly polite.  One of our sons is like that.  The daughter just the opposite. 

there are obviously contractual obligations reguarding this portal, who hasn't been stuck in a bad long term contract

cell phone companies would have never had start up capital if they hadn't stuck it to people

It's my guess that McCain has got himself in a real pickle because, as Howard Dean pointed out, his own position on the public financing was memorialized in a formal opinion from the FEC, documented in a letter and McCain can't get an opinion because the FEC doesn't have a quorum and the reason there's no quorum, I guess, is because Bush Two hasn't nominated members that are acceptable to the Senate.  So, Bush not doing is biting McCain in the a**.

And then, one would think there's a difference between accumulating funds in a special account for the general election--from which they are easily returned if not ultimately wanted--and using the promise of revenue to guarantee a loan of money that's already been spent.  Even if there are later sufficient funds to cancel the loan, the promise of money was in fact used as collateral.  Which may or may not have been a legal use to begin with.  People who play the stock market have gotten used to using stock they don't actually own to sell "short" but using general election funds in that way ................... 

c-span 2 s/b showing the debate at 7:30 et
http://www.c-span.org/watch/cs_cspan2_rm...

7:36 AM EST

good analysis upthread (esp from Monica) about the debate last night and about Hillary in general

mobilize and inspire

mobilize and inspire

mobilize and inspire

If the American people are activated, that's how change is going to happen.

If the American people are activated, that's how change is going to happen.

If the American people are activated, that's how change is going to happen.

///

QUOTE from last night's debate in Cleveland which caught my attention:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/26/us/politics/26text-debate.html?pagewanted=all

"...And we had the potential of bringing people together to actually get something done.

I am absolutely clear that hope is not enough. And it is not going to be easy to pass health care. If it was, it would have already gotten done. It's not going to be easy to have a sensible energy policy in this country. ExxonMobil made $11 billion last quarter. They are not going to give up those profits easily.

But what I also believe is that the only way we are going to actually get this stuff done is, number one, we're going to have to mobilize and inspire the American people so that they're paying attention to what their government is doing. And that's what I've been doing in this campaign, and that's what I will do as president.

And there's nothing romantic or silly about that. If the American people are activated, that's how change is going to happen."

"The second thing we've going to have to do is we're actually going to have to go after the special interests. "

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/26/us/politics/26text-debate.html?pagewanted=all

///

"The second thing we've going to have to do is we're actually going to have to go after the special interests.

Senator Clinton in one of these speeches -- it may have been the same speech where you showed the clip -- said you can't just wave a magic wand and expect special interests to go away. That is absolutely true, but it doesn't help if you're taking millions of dollars in contributions from those special interests. They are less likely to go away.

So it is important for us to crack down on how these special interests are able to influence Congress. And yes, it is important for us to inspire and mobilize and motivate the American people to get involved and pay attention. "

~Sen Barack Obama (Democrat)

More Political Films


Wag The Dog http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wag_the_Dog...

Ghosts of Mississippi http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghosts_of_M...

Focus http://movies.nytimes.com/movie/255714/F...

Primary Colors http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primary_Col...

7:49 AM EST

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080227/ap_on_el_pr/clinton_ann_richards;_ylt=ApbIf1texR9zbnz6XvJbuxRB5494

Richards' sons object to Clinton video

By NEDRA PICKLER, Associated Press Writer

Tue Feb 26, 11:30 PM ET

AUSTIN, Texas - The two sons of Ann Richards, the late former Texas governor, are objecting to an Internet video published by Hillary Rodham Clinton's presidential campaign that suggests their mother would have supported Clinton.

...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rC-GYduJeI

Primary Colors (1998): Stanton Straight Talk

Cecile Richards has a slight career-enhancing "motive," methinks.

*cough* Hillary's no feminist, that's for sure.

Richards' sons should sue. I would (slimebag Clintonistas).

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/NYfem...

Wag The Dog

<A phrase used adnausium against Bill Clinton's Administration

What baffles me is that *Wag The Dog* has not been used against the Republicans, because using the phrase against the Rethugs and 'Cain will define them !

Fear - Wag The Dog

I am not interested in stomping feet on Bill or Hillary's head.

Attacks s/b turning to 'Cain, Bush, corrupt Republicans, AND special/corporate interests.

TTFN, as I go off to generate tax revenue to pay for everyone else's $3/600 per child tax GRANT. 

I didnt watch the debate last night, instead doing my patriotic duty to get this countyr back on track again, for a betetr furure for our kids and the world they will grow up in........to amke a differance in the all out strugle against tyranny and oppression...............to uphold these truths to be self evident, for life liberty justics and the American way....................

I went to the hockey game.................

Clinton would be miles ahead to fire Penn because she can't win a General Election with this kind of a campaign. but I'll bet he has a pretty air tight contract, just like who-ever runs this comment section

dysfunctional ... takes months to fix

Out of the horse's mouth/related orifices, Phil.

"Blue State Digital makes the Internet work for you. Whether you need quick buzz or a long-term relationship with your members and customers, with our technology and strategic expertise you will realize your goals."

[....]

http://www.bluestatedigital.com/results....

FEC reports don't lie.

SoapBlox can whip up a real blog within 24 hrs.

See link above.

None of this four years plus bullshit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuRjX7Srw0I

Wag The Dog

if there are page after page of the fine print hire a good lawyer to read it for you, but I'll bet the value of this space as a fund raising tool(that has been lost) would make up for any breech of contract penalty 

8:19 AM EST

.
Imn2Paine
Wed, 02/27/08

Reply to this

I am not interested in stomping feet on Bill or Hillary's head.

Attacks s/b turning to 'Cain, Bush, corrupt Republicans, AND special/corporate interests.

...

+++

Paine -

Agreed.

However, one step at a time.  The next step is for Obama to win the dem nomination, against a very formidable candidate, who, along with her husband, has proven that they can be like a phoenix that rises from the ashes and win.

IMO Obama let his guard down a tad, especially on the day of the primary vote in N Hampshire (Hillary was still campaigning that day, he [being seemingly crowned with front-runner status, with the media expecting another Kerry-like zoom to the dem nomination] wasn't that day, being advised to lay low as to not say anything that might jeopardize that front-runner status).

Obama and his advisors, have since learned their lesson and never let their guard down now.

If he can successfully dispense with Hillary, then he can fully train his guns on McCain.

DemocracyFest - Early Bird Discount Tickets - Last Chance!

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/24009...

8:22 AM EST

IMO, next Tuesday, March 4, has the feel of a general election, with the forces of the dem status quo arrayed against the forces of dem change.

It is good that the dems are going through this (it will make the party stronger in the long run, especially with bringing in progressives and indys, who have felt like they been out in the cold for a long time).

Obama just has shown competence as player/manager of the total team and hasn't made many mistakes and some of that is just luck

there is only one person who can remove the head campaign manager and candidates are always traveling and prepping for the next event and in the moment and rarely see the big picture and they can't be involved in moving this or that staffer to this or that state

they have to get the main theme right to start with (CHANGE is a no brainer after Bush)

make it about the future (HOPE)

make it about more than themselves, create a movement, and here Obama is magic

and then as volunteers and money flow your way use them wisely

Obama couldn't really say no to Oprah and when she crowned him lord of lords and it went to his head (only for a moment but a critical one before New Hampshire) it was the only stumble in the race so far and it shows how dangerous it is to be the presumptive nominee which he was in those days

Oprah will be a fantastic team mate to bring women into the unity mission after Clinton is out, I'm not casting blame, just pointing out how few stumbles there have been, the Clintons have made dozens

It is part of a larger redesign of the whole website, so, it is going to take a little bit of time.  I know how maddening the comment-rearrangement can be, but the IT folks are working on it.  Thanks.

Danny 

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k13P-db9aIo

The Official Story  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Official_StoryThe Long Walk Home  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Long_Walk_HomeMarie http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie_%28film%29

Happy Birthday to my good and dear friend Ralph Nader - an America patriot who was fighting the good fight for American consumers before most of us were born, who is defending our Constitution better than nearly all in Congress - and who DID NOT lose the 2000 election for Al Gore ( who was not the Al Gore we know and love today, and who waged a pitiful campaign against a fly-weight nobody who became a fly-infested pResident ).

Nader's presence has already been followed by Barack Obama's addressing a Jewish group - and clearly differentiating between those Israelis who cherish peace and those who respond to Palestinian attacks three-hundredfold in terms of carnage. Those peace-loving Jewish people, both in America and in Israel are heroic to stand up against their counterparts - the way Constitution and peace-loving Americans stand up against Bushies.

I enjoy stomping on Bill and Hillary's head. Since Hillary is nearing dead duck status, it is about time to move to McCain. She ain't dead yet but is on life support. Hopefully, it is all over next week.

Juan Cole about names...
http://www.juancole.com/

[snip]
I want to say something about Barack Hussein Obama's name. It is a name to be proud of. It is an American name. It is a blessed name. It is a heroic name, as heroic and American in its own way as the name of General Omar Nelson Bradley or the name of Benjamin Franklin. And denigrating that name is a form of racial and religious bigotry of the most vile and debased sort. It is a prejudice against names deriving from Semitic languages!

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/marie_a_...

Marie - A True Story (1985)

Genre: Dramas

Starring: Sissy Spacek, Jeff Daniels, John Cullum, Timothy Carhart

Director: Roger Donaldson

Synopsis:
Based on an actual event, "Marie" is the story of a woman who was appointed to head the State Board of Pardons of Tennessee, only to quickly discover that the state government was riddled with graft, corruption and even murder.

Happy Birthday to my good and dear friend Ralph Nader

  and Chelsea Clinton too. one part of the debate I did catch on the clips was the clamor for autographs from the candidates afterwards and Clinton's handler was fretting over how long it was taking or something and Chelsea was smiling and enjoying the moment and grounded looking; comfortable in the moment and I couldn't stop myself from looking ahead a decade or two

that is a really good generation of young people and they have chosen Obama to be the next President and I seem to think wisely

one on the Clinton mistake list was putting the youth vote down, they aren't the only parents to have raised good kids 

New thread now available.

David, I tend to agree with you and have wondered about the bad campaign Gore ran. Maybe it was the hand he was dealt.

1 - By this time, it was pretty apparent that Ross Perot's allegations about the giant sucking sound being jobs moving off shore was ture.

2 - The dotnet economy petered out and there was nothing to follow it up. The economy was pulling back. Al didn't have much of an scenario for what's next.

3 - Bubba and his overly-active zipper meant that Al had to keep him at arm's length.

4 - Thanks to the DLC, the Dems state organizations were in shambles. Al had a hand in this.

Al may have done the best he could with a bad hand