Howard Dean is first.

Thank you Linda.

17.

Monica Smith
Fri, 12/14/07


15. I don't mean to be unsympathetic, but humans are just going to have to get used to the fact that they can't control the planet.

It actually seems to be pretty typical that organic species use up the resources they need to survive and then they become extinct.
-------

Monica, I'm curious do you really in such a low regard of humans or it is just your personal "scientific dominant"?

Do you suggest that we (humans, of course, humans) can't avoid self-destruction, by not able to control ourselves (and therefore the Planet too)?

I should remind you that human and "species" (organic or not) ARE NOT one and the same.

"Controlling the planet" (e.g. controlling ourselves) MEANS setting up ourselves FREE, can't believe we are going to end up been still slaves!

So, Governor Dean, you were in Guam, did you made a side trip to Bali while you were over there?  :)

This picture almost seems surreal

3.  Well, humans are organisms and they are a species with a solitary specimen.  When I say that it seem typical, I am not being deterministic.  One hopes that human reason is sufficient to learn from past experience and adapt its behavior so as not to extinguish itself.

69.

Monica Smith
Fri, 12/14/07

...I definitely think that communal action (government) is necessary because there are some things an individual can't take care of by him/herself (dealing with acts of nature or violent aggression)...
-------------

It's widespread confusion to consider "government" actions as "communal" ones.

The cause of course is the same: the original confusion between "government" and "community".

Governmental actions - assume "by law enforceable" ones.
Communal actions - assume mutually (e.g. voluntarily) agreed by community members ones.

BIG difference!

5.

Monica Smith
Fri, 12/14/07



3. Well, humans are organisms and they are a species with a solitary specimen. When I say that it seem typical, I am not being deterministic. One hopes that human reason is sufficient to learn from past experience and adapt its behavior so as not to extinguish itself.

-----------

Monica you losing CONSCIOUSNESS!!!

As for poor people.  It's my opinion that every person is entitled to whatever resources are necessary to sustain it.  Since our society has chosen, via the mechanism of private property, to restrict access to resources to a select population (those who own property) we have, IMHO, assumed a responsibility to make special provisions for those to whom access has been denied.  It was argued, as I said earlier, that granting private property rights would insure more careful stewardship of the land and water and air, but that has proven not to be the case.  Ownership doesn't make people more conscientious.  Which is why we have now developed regulations to "protect" the environment from despoilation.  Poverty is relative.  But, if we have created a system where everyone needs money to access the things they need to survive, then we have an obligation to see that money is available to them---and not set up all sort of conditions to make them QUALIFY.  The fault lies not with the have-nots, but with the haves.

6.  The U.S. form of government is based on consensus.  WE are the government.  The officials who are appointed or elected are the agents of government.  That is, they are empowered to carry out our bidding.  That the agents or stewards are upon occasion unjust does not mean that's how they are expected to act.

9.

Monica Smith
Fri, 12/14/07

...That the agents or stewards are upon occasion unjust does not mean that's how they are expected to act.
-------

We've already passed it by..., one may live in whatever "expected" World he/she chooses.

4.

Poor Howard had to go on to Honolulu after the Guam stop to make a couple of Friday fundraising stops at the Mandalay Restaurant and at a private home. Prolly no time for Bali, gee whiz.

Next time, please take me with you on these trips so I can help you out with some of the tiresome, boring chores, like snorkling or sunning on the beach!

Just kidding, we know he works very hard on these trips and would rather be back shoveling snow in VT;))

5.

 One hopes that human reason is sufficient to learn from past experience and adapt its behavior so as not to extinguish itself.

Big Al is doing more than just hoping. He is out there getting his hands dirty trying to wake up the world before hope is dead.

How is this thing working today?

I like this post.

Nice picture of Gov. Dean. Aloha! Do they say that in Guam?


Great show! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VFQTcrXp...

9.

Monica Smith
Fri, 12/14/07

...That the agents or stewards are upon occasion unjust does not mean that's how they are expected to act.
-------

"Freedom" to live in an imaginary World instead of real one IS NOT a freedom. It is a unconscious slavery

Al said that the next US Government is likely to sign on to Global Change Mitigation. I wish I could be that confident.

If one of the Corporate Democrats is elected, his/her donors will be pushing hard for them to follow the Bush line.

And of course, if the congressional Dems stick with their clueless, feckless, cowardly "stragedy", they could very well lose in 08.

Progressives are that angry!

OOPS:

7.

former
Fri, 12/14/07

Monica you losing CONSCIOUSNESS!!! =
Monica you forgetting such a human (only!) property like CONSCIOUSNESS!!!

Rawstory

Spurned by major newspapers, Dem Congressman takes 'impeach Cheney' appeal to Web

Nick Juliano Published: Friday December 14, 2007



As the House Judiciary Committee continues to refuse any action on proposals to impeach Vice President Dick Cheney, three of that panel's members tried to take their case to influential op-ed pages of the nation's largest newspapers.

They were turned down by every one -- including the New York Times, Washington Post and Miami Herald -- so now one of the lawmakers has taken his campaign to the Internet.

Rep. Robert Wexler (D-FL) on Friday launched a new Web site, WexlerWantsHearings.com to advance his call to impeach Cheney. The site hosts an op-ed article censored by the nation's major newspapers and outlines the case for impeaching Cheney.

"The truth is the mainstream media have no interest in this issue," Wexler said Friday.

"They have bought into the notion that impeachment hearings are outside the bounds of what the congress ought to be doing," the six-term Congressman elaborated during a conference call Friday.

The House Judiciary Committee has before it a resolution introduced by Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) calling for Cheney's impeachment and accusing the vice president of a raft of high crimes, including manipulating intelligence in the run-up to the Iraq war, obstructing federal investigations and conspiring to expose the identity of covert CIA agent Valerie Plame.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has said impeachment in strictly off the table, and the Judiciary Committee seems unlikely to move forward with any hearings. Wexler encouraged impeachment supporters to sign a petition on his new site to allay the notions of Democratic leaders that impeachment supporters are little more than "a fringe, marginal group of people."

Wexler said the House has the constitutional obligation to begin impeachment hearings to investigate malfeasance within the Bush administration, and he blamed the lack of enthusiasm thus far on the "bad taste" left by the GOP's last impeachment crusade.

"People are just afraid that we would just be putting the shoe on the other foot and just doing ... what the Republicans did to Bill Clinton," Wexler told the conference call, which was organized by Democrats.com.

The "kangaroo court" Republicans used to impeach Clinton, on grounds that he lied about his liaison with an intern, cannot become the precedent by which the constitutional tool is judged, Wexler said.

Although Bush and Cheney will be leaving the White House for good in 13 months, Wexler said impeachment hearings were necessary because of the need to ferret out possible criminality in the administration.

"We have to follow the evidence where it leads," he said. "We have an obligation to do it, and to do it as thoroughly as possible."



Wexler posted the following video appeal on his impeachment Web site.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQDLyKGX268

 

To follow up 15, Jim Hightower articulated what so many of us feel in his December "Hightower Lowdown."

Snippet:

......"people in general and progressives in particular are expressing profound dismay at the deterioration of America's Democracy, not only because of the Bush-Cheney regime, but also, and especially, because of the fecklessness of the Democratic Congress."

He goes on to enumerate all of the cowardly capitulations of the Democrats to the 2-bit thug who is president and (incredibly enough) to the Republican minority.

4:22 PM

14.  Well, actually, acording to Republicans, freedom is obedience.  But, obedience is subjugation, not slavery.  I think the slave is characterized by labor.  One who is subject can be entirely idle.

GO DENNIS!

(ONE OF THE FEW COURAGEOUS DEMOCRATS)

http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/linkframe.php?linkid=47502

Wexler said that impeachment hearings weren't just an option available to Congress, but a requirement.

"This administration has abused its power in office...and it is the obligation --- not discretionary --- but it is the obligation of this Congress to investigate," he said. "And that's what I and some of my colleagues are beginning to call for."
...
"If we want to stop Iran from becoming a nuclear power, we need to become more popular. If we want to avoid a traumatic split between Sunnis and Shiites that endangers further our national security, we need to become more popular...If we want to engage with the Chinese in a more beneficial way, we need to become more popular."

"Let me tell you one more thing those impeachment hearings will do," he concluded. "It'll make America more popular."
...
"I urge the Judiciary Committee to schedule impeachment hearings immediately and not let this issue languish as it has over the last six months," Wexler stated at the time. "Only through hearings can we begin to correct the abuses of Dick Cheney and the Bush Administration; and, if it is determined in these hearings that Vice President Cheney has committed High Crimes and Misdemeanors, he should be impeached and removed from office."

Please keep in mind that until the demise of "sovereign immunity" and the passage of the civil rights legislation of the '60s, culminating in the Freedom Of Information Act in 1966, it was practically impossible to have government BY the people because there was no way for them to know what was being done in their name.  The neo-con agenda isn't just a cute name.  They authoritarians want to engineer a return to the status quo ante--befor the great unwashed public got to interfere.

17.

Monica Smith
Fri, 12/14/07

......
"We have to follow the evidence where it leads," he said. "We have an obligation to do it, and to do it as thoroughly as possible."

Wexler posted the following video appeal on his impeachment Web site.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQDLyKGX2...
------------

When it'll lead to the evidence of Demos been fully and deeply complicit in EVERYTHING Bush&Co. has done..., he'll return back to the "real" World and stop it where it started.
American history knows enough similar cases.

THE IOWA "DEBATE"

http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_mike_fol_071214_democratic_debate_3b__22.htm

Watching the Democratic debate yesterday answered a question that I have long pondered; is it possible for the mentally incompetent to run for president? The answer is; no question about it.

At least it is not necessary for a president to have even the slightest grip on reality. Math is also not an obligatory skill. The ability to speak in whole sentences that contain subjects and verbs is obviously not a condition. In fact, the only stipulation that I observed to apparently be an actual requirement was that one must be well versed in the “spin till you win” discipline.

Before you have some kind of seizure, I also watched the Republican debate and it was equally horrifying. With, I must say, the exception of Ron Paul, who they didn’t want to let in, but he has too many people donating money to keep him out.

Most of the candidates threw some crumbs to the Iowa corn growers by saying such things as “all cars should be mandated as flex fuel vehicles.” Neglecting of course, that such a move is very costly and the consumer would just have to subsidize the farmer and the auto company. Hold on there, I’m not against lower pollutants. There is more to the story.

If all of the farmland in the U.S. was planted to corn and all of that corn was converted to ethanol, it would provide approximately 12% of the current fuel consumption for autos alone. No food, just fuel. So given that fact, if all cars were equipped as flex fuel autos, and all food was converted to fuel, 88% of the cars would have none to burn. But, when in Iowa, lie like a rug and don’t worry, no one will do the math.

Nearly every candidate suggested that the U.S. is losing jobs. Gee, we haven’t noticed. Several were going to get tough with China who loans us $ 1 Billion per day just to keep us treading water, and China also holds enough of our debt to choke a large horse. Try going in today and getting tough with your banker.

I found it interesting that not one candidate announced that NAFTA and our entry into the WTO which allowed the China syndrome and American Corps to freely leave the U.S., was ushered in by Bill Clinton, not the Republicans that they blamed for our job loses.

Barrack Obama wants to balance the budget and double foreign aid. Hillary Clinton wants to promote free trade and grow our economy. Joe Biden wants to send our kids to a government school for 16 years, all on the cuff. The only thing Bill Richardson was sure of is that he wants to lose weight.

The point is, there are few good guys in established government on either side of the aisle. The promises are fiscally empty and irresponsible.

I forgot, it's 4:38 PM

TEST

Count s/b below 25.

I think the point I am trying to make is that there's no reason to be discouraged.  We have just begun to fight.  If we are late to the battle, it's because we didn't realize how much of a challenge real government by the people represents to the establishment.  Which is not to say that there's a "vast right-wing conspiracy."  Especially not since it's evident that authoritarianism isn't restricted to Republican politicians.  The only real difference between Republican and Democratic authoritarian rule is that while the former rely on threats to keep the population in line, the latter rely on bribes.  Or, in the language of Senator Clinton, "help for the poor."

Mukasey Won't Give Congress
CIA Tape Details

Thanks Feinstein, Thanks Schumer, Thanks Bluedogs

4:47 PM

Well, I do think it's facile to blame Chinese producers for the junk American wholesalers import.  But, as I said this morning, our nation has been pettified.  People are treated and disposed of like household pets.  First the producers were dispatched, then the consumers. Now all that's left is pets--creatures that get rewarded for performing tricks or punished for acting up.  If they act up too much, they simply get "put to sleep."

If you've read today's Hannah post, or if not, perhaps I should explain my point.  You see, I suspect that much of the apparent popularity of Clinton and Obama in the polls is a consequence of guilt--of people expressing approval of individuals whom their community has taught them to dismiss.   Now, some of that support may be an expression of what they really feel, but much of it may be in the vein of "let's see what happens, if I do something that I'm not supposed to do?"  Because, you know, discrimination against blacks and women and (more recently) hispanics is largely a social artifact designed to control the majority population. (Yes, I know women are in the numerical majority, but they don't carry comparable weight in the decision-making sectors).  The pressures, if there are any, against actually electing either of them are going to be subtle.  To a certain extent, the leeway given to them as front-runners is supect.  It's almost as if someone were practicing restraint, sending the message, in effect, "see, we're not prejudiced" until they silently and efficiently lower the boom.  And then, because of the false meme that the candidate is responsible for his/her success or failure, it will be entirely logical to argue, "see, they just didn't measure up."  It's this argument which I am at pains to refute when I say it's not about the candidates; it's about the electorate.

John 

 Al Gore:

"Over the next two years, the United States is going to be somewhere it is not now. You must anticipate that."
"I'm not asking you to just go on the basis of hope and expectation."
"I must tell you candidly that I cannot promise that the person who is elected will have the position I expect they will have, but I can tell you I believe it is quite likely."

"If you decide that it is so impmortant for you to fully express the anger and frustration at not being able to fill in that blank, NOW, in the next few days here in Bali, the entire world could lose momentum and could lose progress. If you decide to work constructively and continue the progress that has already been made on all of the items other than targets and timetables for mandatory reductions on the hope and with the expectation that before this process is concluded in Copenhagen, you WILL be able to fill in that blank with the help of a different position from the United States, then you can make great progress here."

"Believe me, if I could snap my fingers and change the position of the United States of America and change the position of some other countries, and make it instantly much easier to move forward WITH targets and timetables, included in the language you approve here, I would do so in an instant.

"Change is possible."

 "Consider what the position of the government of Australia would have been just two months ago.  Look at what a difference it makes when the people of Australia change their government and the Prime Minister of Australia comes here having raitified the Kyoto Treaty. 

Yeeaayyy......

Go Dennis.....

Go Robert Wexler........

When I talked to Wexler's office the other day they said things were starting to move. Since then Barbara Boxer said she was for impeachment, and now Wexler is taking another step. We have to respond en masse, that's the only thing that will work. Dennis and Wexler need to show it's not just fringe.

Let's sign the petition and call Wexler to thank him. we can thank Dennis too, He could use some love. Without him, it wouldn't even be.

There's another petition at independentprimary.com

Mukasey Rejects Call for CIA Tape Details

During the confirmation hearings I remember at least one blogger here, and maybe more, saying that Mukasey was a good person who would do right if confirmed.

OK. Fess up whoever you are. Don't make us have to dig back and find you. 

Watching the Democratic debate yesterday answered a question that I have long pondered; is it possible for the mentally incompetent to run for president?

You didn't have to wait so long to find that out. You could learned it from watching the 1979 and 1999 GOP debates with Reagan and Bush. 

And not only can the mentally incompetent run for president; they can BECOME president. 

When it'll lead to the evidence of Demos been fully and deeply complicit in EVERYTHING Bush&Co. has done...,

You've probably stated the real reason impeachment is "off the table." 

Here is a little Friday pick me up - check out this video of a couple's first dance at their wedding

http://www.whoisthemonkey.com/videos/47/...

Sitka....

I'm hoping that the latest light being shown on their complicity will cause those who are not guilty to come out for impeachment to separate themselves from the others. Sort of like, just because you did it, I'm not going down with you. Hope ,,,,

I'm hoping that the latest light being shown on their complicity will cause those who are not guilty to come out for impeachment to separate themselves from the others.

They always seem to stick closer together at these times. Kind of like.....I'll cover your ass now if you'll cover mine later. 

The corporate media's new meme is "the fight between Hillary and Obama." The trouble is, the oly fight is Hillary getting caught smearing multiple times. By lumping them together they implicate Obama unjustly, just as they did to Dean when Gopheart smeared him.

Will Iowan's fall for it? Bet on it. 

There is a NEW THREAD.