Home » Blog » Going Undercover at a Ron Paul Campaign Event
Blog for America
Going Undercover at a Ron Paul Campaign Event
Linked to groups: Greater Kansas City Democracy for America
A report from an undercover liberal/progressive at a Kansas City area Ron Paul campaign event.
Last night the inestimable Murph and I put on our crack journalist hats and attended a meeting of Ron Paul supporters presenting campaign training for Missouri and Kansas. We wanted to get a feel for how well they are prepared, how many supporters they have, and also, of course, simply for the thrill of doing undercover work as a card-carrying member of the DNC at a GOP campaign event. You never know when some aggressive staffers will attempt to manhandle you out of the building or something.
My first impression was the size of the crowd- Johnson County, Kansas, which covers a bunch of Kansas City suburbs just south of the city, is about as red as a place can get. It is the fastest-growing and most populated county in the state, and ranks 43rd in highest per-capita income in the entire country. There are places here where Hummers, Porsches, and Ferraris are a common sight. The turnout for this particular event, billed as grassroots training, was pitiful considering the blood-red status if the area- Murph counted 35 people when we walked in, with 5 or so stragglers coming in late.
Ever since I started having regular running battles with Ron Paul supporters on this site and elsewhere, I have wondered who these folks are. It's not like Ron Paul has always had a huge, nationwide grassroots following, so who are these people? Where did they come from?
Here's my unscientific, pseudo-sociological assessment of the crowd last night; there were 4 or 5 "crazy old men"(you know the type, those guys who seem to have lost the acquaintance of not only a comb, but clearly a chunk of their sanity), quite a few young guys with that ill-dressed, brush-cut look that screams former Bush supporter, and a smattering of NASCAR types ranging from just out of high school to one foot in the grave. Suffice it to say Murph and I were clearly the only guys with fashion sense in the whole room, despite the 25% or so attendees under 25.
If I were to sum the crowd up in one word, it would be fringe.
One guy seemed like a professional handler of some kind, and a few of those standing seemed to be campaign staffers . The handler arranged the seating and stood in the rear, arms crossed, ensuring everyone signed in on a notepad.
The speaker was one of those soccer mom types, and she was clearly unprepared for the meeting. Actually Murph and I split after 15 minutes of watching her fumble her login to the Ron Paul website on the large projector screen (even stopping to login to her Yahoo mail for her username!) The purpose of the gathering was to watch three 40-minute training videos, but once we saw they were easily accessible online, the tedium got the better of us and we left. You can find those videos on the Ron Paul website with registration, or go here to view them without providing personal data.
As to the presentation, the main theme seemed to be contacting as many Republicans and Independents as possible, and making sure they were registered with the GOP so they can vote in the primaries. Per "soccer mom" it seems anyone with GOP connections can buy Republican voter lists online for the entire Kansas City area for $400, though she said the intention was only to buy specific targeted neighborhoods. She actually said that the central office instructed them not to "mess with Democrats" at all, which makes sense. They would have to sell the Republican party to these voters, attempting to entice turncoats to participate in the KS/MO primaries. My guess is that dog won't hunt.
One astute older gentleman in what seemed like a bright yellow raver shirt asked the $64,000 question; why put a lot of effort into the primaries when it's likely the early primaries (Nevada, Michigan, Florida, and South Carolina just to name a few) will crown the nominee prior to Super Tuesday, February 5th? None of the presenters or staff could answer this, which is likely why the meeting seemed so slapdash and unorganized.
Overall, it seemed clear that the Ron Paul operation is relying on fringe groups culled online for their grassroots efforts. It was also clear that the campaign was just hitting the ground in the KC metro area, and that the primary effort here might very well be wasted.
In my personal opinion, any group that unprofessional and disorganized is hardly a threat. I expected swarms of folks wishing to learn about Dr. Paul's campaign. What we got was a bunch of disparate crazies and an ill-prepared soccer mom. If Ron Paul finds a way to outlast the early primary states, it's likely he'll get crushed in the KC area without a huge amount of help from the national party apparatus.
Show: Expand All Reply
I for one applaud Ron Paul for his foreign policy views and for having the guts to stand up to the power machines ...........his domestic ones however are almost as scary as the other candidates...................
Hey Mike - Let's not leave out Huckabee. Simmering
under that great sense of humor is a complete
wingnut who only believes in creationism. No more
wingnuts!!!!
mary vb
Thu, 11/29/07
9:32 am
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
great post mary and hope your holidays were good.............I have republican roots and am amazed just how low that party, its candidates and many supporters have sunk.............
Fox wrote “Good news!!! U.S. economic growth fastest in four years GDP for third quarter steamed ahead at revised 4.9 percent rate"
For wealthy investors, the news could not be better. Now on to other business news:
“U.S. foreclosure filings nearly doubled in October from the same month last year, the latest sign many homeowners are falling behind on mortgage payments and increasingly losing their homes, according to a mortgage research company.
“Ohio's foreclosure rate remained among the highest in the country.
“A total of 224,451 foreclosure filings were reported nationwide in October, up 94 percent from 115,568 in the same month a year ago, Irvine-based RealtyTrac Inc. said Thursday.
“ . . . .
“The trend was particularly evident in Ohio, where 45 percent of all foreclosure filings during the month were notices of bank repossessions. The repossessions represented 46 percent of all filings in Missouri and 37 percent in Michigan.
“Economic woes and job losses have exacerbated the housing slump in the Midwest.”
Read on for additional grim statistics regarding Bush’s war time economy, based on military expenditures for which we don’t collect revenues and consumer purchases for which the purchasers don’t earn enough to pay.
Good morning, Mike & maryvb,
It's getting on for the end of the afternoon here and I just opened the WaPo webpage to see this news.
My guess is that the cause of death was pure unadulterated nastiness, exacerbated by hypocrisy.
They'd better start clearing out a lot of rooms in Hell for the likes of this man.
===============
Former Rep. Henry Hyde Dies at 83
The Associated Press
Thursday, November 29, 2007; 9:51 AM
WASHINGTON -- Former Rep. Henry Hyde, the Illinois Republican who steered the impeachment proceedings against President Clinton and championed government restrictions on the funding of abortions, has died. He was 83.
The death of the Illinois Republican was announced on Capitol Hill by the office of House Minority Leader John Boehner.
There was no immediate word on the cause of his death.
[...]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...
Vindication for Monica, who has said this all along.
================
Bush's Next Preemptive Strike
By Harold Meyerson
Thursday, November 29, 2007; A25
George W. Bush is focusing now on his legacy. Duck. Run. Hide.
Some of his legacy-building, I'll allow, is commendable, if overdue -- most particularly, his efforts to resurrect the Israeli-Palestinian peace process, which he ignored for seven long years. But the linchpin of Bush's legacy, it appears, is to make his Iraq policy a permanent fixture of American statecraft.
On Monday, Bush and Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki signed a declaration pledging that their governments would put in place a long-term political and security pact sometime next year. "The shape and size of any long-term, or longer than 2008, U.S. presence in Iraq will be a key matter for negotiation between the two parties, Iraq and the United States," Lt. Gen. Douglas Lute, the White House official in charge of Iraq war matters, said at the briefing unveiling the agreement.
What Bush will almost surely be pushing for is permanent U.S. bases in Iraq, enshrined in a pact he can sign a few months before he leaves office. And here, as they used to say, is the beauty part: As far as Bush is concerned, he doesn't have to seek congressional ratification for such an enduring commitment of American force, treasure and lives.
[...]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...
7.
In all due respects to you, that IMO was not called for. I don't care who the man or woman is -- I don't have the right to damn someone to Hell.
HAVE THEY NO SHAME?
http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/linkframe.php?linkid=46518
Every Saturday, the president of the United States gives a radio address to the nation. It is followed by the Democratic response, usually given by a senator or representative. This past Saturday the Democrats chose retired Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez to give their response, the same general accused in at least three lawsuits in the U.S. and Europe of authorizing torture and cruel, inhumane and degrading treatment of prisoners in Iraq. This, combined with the Democrats’ endorsement of Attorney General Michael Mukasey despite his unwillingness to label waterboarding as torture, indicates that the Democrats are increasingly aligned with President Bush’s torture policies.
This is not about politics. This is about the moral compass of the nation. The Democrats may be celebrating a retired general who has turned on his commander in chief. But the public should take pause.
The Democrats had a chance to draw a line in the sand, to absolutely require Mukasey to denounce waterboarding before his elevation to attorney general. Now they have chosen as their spokesman a discredited general, linked to the most egregious abuses in Iraq. The Bush administration passed Sanchez over for a promotion, worried about reliving the Abu Ghraib scandal during the 2006 election year. Now it’s the Democrats who have resuscitated him. Have they no shame?
* rdorgan
Thu, 11/29/07
9:47 am
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Err, ahh...........um are you arguing with yourself? This clock is weird too..............
3.
Michael Ellis
Thu, 11/29/07
9:21 am
I for one applaud Ron Paul for his foreign policy views and for having the guts to stand up to the power machines ...........his domestic ones however are almost as scary as the other candidates...
---------
First, there is NO disconnection, NO dis-joint between "foreign policy views" and "domestic ones" FOR THOSE!!! who applies PRINCIPLES ("ideology"..., lol) to both set views. The one IS EXTENSION of another.
However such a disconnection DOES EXIST for those only WHO DO NOT have PRINCIPLES at the core of their basic philosophy and those are, as one may guess...lol, all of the rest candidates in both Parties (except, maybe, Kucinich and Gravel).
It is, imo, still scary for you Mike because, I guess, in your views Government is a People's "helper" (maybe it really was to some extents, long, long ago, say around 1930's depression years. At the same time just recall WHO brought those depression years into the life of Americans? - Again the Government!).
Today Government become exclusively TOOL of Corporations' (NOT People's!) Power. That's why getting rid of Government means...bringing power to People (see Ron Paul's mantra)..., and wise versa, taking power to People means...taking it away from Government (see Howard Dean's mantra).
There is only two forms of power we know today: Corporate Government or People.
The problem we, "The People" face, the only one: we don't know yet how to replace former with the latter, have no experience in self-governance and afraid not been able to handle it.
It'll come....., anyway, there is no other choice.
Some of his legacy-building, I'll allow, is commendable, if overdue -- most particularly, his efforts to resurrect the Israeli-Palestinian peace process, which he ignored for seven long years.
A botched photo-op should hardly be called effort.
They'd better start clearing out a lot of rooms in Hell for the likes of this man.
Whever people who are too rotten for hell are sent is where he should go.
15.
Mike -
Judy's 8 was 7 (before the blog clock bonged again). So my post was directed at her comment.
former
Thu, 11/29/07
10:07 am
___________________________________________________________________________
you arent suggesting......................
I guess, in your views Government is a People's "helper"
Certainly not in the hands of Republicans.
18.
Michael Ellis
Thu, 11/29/07
10:25 am
_______________________
you arent suggesting...
-----------
...lol, not Mike, that case, as you may remember INCLUDED Government VERY, VERY MUCH!
I'm talking when THERE IS NO ONE...., only we, "The People"!
18.
Sitka
Thu, 11/29/07
10:18 am
Reply to this
I guess, in your views Government is a People's "helper"
Certainly not in the hands of Republicans.
------------
Then, my guess, you assume, expect, hope, await..., etc. it would be better in the hands of Democrats?!
..., lol, but it WAS ALREADY in those very hands MANY, MANY times...FOR WHAT?....To end up with...what we have today!
former
Thu, 11/29/07
10:33 am
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Just kidding....I kinda like that trumpet tune though..........
21.
Michael Ellis
Thu, 11/29/07
10:37 am
------
I've understood.
Editor from a newspaper in North Carolina (ie. Salisbury Post) sets the record straight:
http://www.salisburypost.com/opinion/342718140979610.php
Thu, Nov 29, 2007
|Letter: Obama unpatriotic?
I received an e-mail today that disturbed me. The purpose of it was to make a political statement, as it was a picture of Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and two others standing on a raised platform with our country's flag behind it. Every one of them had placed their hand over their heart while the national anthem was played, except Obama. His hands were clasped in front of him.
The accompanying commentary asked the same question that I'm about to ask. How can we accept a man that refuses to show respect for our flag as a presidential candidate?
— Sandy Smith
Salisbury
Editor's note: This is Obama's response to accusations that the photo (and a related video) suggest a lack of patriorism on his part: "This is the classic dirty trick of the campaign ... This is just so irritating. This was not the Pledge of Allegiance. This woman was singing the 'Star Spangled Banner.' Now, I was taught by my grandfather that you put your hand over your heart during the Pledge of Allegiance. The 'Star Spangled Banner,' you sing. So that's what I did. These aren't the only e-mails that are going out. You've got e-mails saying that I'm a Muslim plant that's trying to take over America and this and that and the other. If you get this e-mail from someone you know, set the record straight. You don't have to curse them out, just tell them that they are misinformed."
iT'S 11:01 AM
I was taught early and often not to speak ill of the dead. So I won't--about hypocritical Henry Hyde. May he rest in peace.
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/
___________________________________________________________________________
Notice the Guy Fawks mask in the background as well..........hmm
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/
___________________________________________________________________________
Notice the Guy Fawks mask in the background as well..........hmm
1.
Fox -
Not so fast.
Next (last) quarter of this year is expected to only be 1.5 growth rate. Not so impressive:
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/071129/jobless_claims.html
AP
Jobless Claims Jump Sharply
Thursday November 29, 8:48 am ET
Number of People Seeking Unemployment Benefits Rises Sharply
WASHINGTON (AP) -- The number of new people signing up for jobless benefits last week jumped sharply, suggesting that the labor market is softening as national economic activity slows.The Labor Department reported Thursday that new applications filed for unemployment insurance rose by a seasonally adjusted 23,000 to 352,000. It was the highest level since Feb. 10.
The report surprised economists. They were forecasting claims to hold steady around 330,000.
The economy, which grew at a brisk 4.9 percent pace in the summer, is expected to slow to a pace of just 1.5 percent or less in the current October-to-December period as housing and credit troubles take their toll on consumers and businesses alike.
On thread topic, I'm no Ron Paul fan but this blog is full of facile judgements about people based upon how they look. It is demeaning and full of stereotypes. This is just a sample below:
there were 4 or 5 "crazy old men"(you know the type, those guys who seem to have lost the acquaintance of not only a comb, but clearly a chunk of their sanity), quite a few young guys with that ill-dressed, brush-cut look that screams former Bush supporter, and a smattering of NASCAR types ranging from just out of high school to one foot in the grave. Suffice it to say Murph and I were clearly the only guys with fashion sense in the whole room, despite the 25% or so attendees under 25.
What were others saying about Dean supporters four years ago. This is just pure bigotry. I am surprised that DFA posted something that is so full of it.
Then, my guess, you assume, expect, hope, await..., etc. it would be better in the hands of Democrats?!
That depends on the Democrats. Good ones are in short supply in DC these days, but that doesn't mean I'm going to start supporting Republicans.
May Henry Hyde become compost quickly (very rancid--cremation would be better)).
Glad he's finally dead (fucking intentionally evil misogynists tend to live what seems like forever).
Best news I've heard all week, Judy!
Good riddance.
I was taught early and often not to speak ill of the dead.
It must depend on how long they've been dead. Otherwise, you couldn't speak truthfully about some.
8.
My guess is that the cause of death was pure unadulterated nastiness, exacerbated by hypocrisy.
They'd better start clearing out a lot of rooms in Hell for the likes of this man.
Well said, Judy.
The guy was a a dirty rotten sexist pig hell bent on destroying Democrats anywhere for any reason.. Wherever he goes from here, hell or otherwise, I care not as long as he is GONE from this earth.
Just read Bush's recent interview with Gibson (transcript here: http://abcnews.go.com/print?id=3891196).
Among usual crap, I've found these President's words:
".....my rhetoric, by the way, is aimed to the Iranian people, which is, and I'll be glad to repeat it here, which is that you've had a grand history, and a great tradition. Our beef is not with the Iranian people, it is with the government that is, you know, has hidden programs from international inspectors, has made very bellicose statements about how they intend to conduct foreign policy, that is promoting terror through organizations like Hezbollah, that is disrupting young democracies like Iraq and Lebanon, and therefore as a result of the actions of your government, you're becoming isolated, and you can do better.
"
It looks like our lovely President has been VERY COMPETENT..., at least to the extents to be able to realize that Iranian Government and Iranian People MAY HAPPEN...lol, NOT TO BE THE ONE and THE SAME entities!
But that’s of course relates only to Iranian People....
As for the American People that idea in the eyes of their “decider” apparently DOES NOT work. Nobody knows why, but only American People ARE the Government....lol.
Curious for how long Americans will NOT be able to notice that they been held by their respective Governments and leaders as idiots!
Replace the word Australian with American, I could be echoing the words of Aussie's Anne, after next year's U.S. prez election:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7109692.stm
Last Updated: Saturday, 24 November 2007, 13:13
PM Howard concedes Australia poll
Australian Prime Minister John Howard has admitted defeat in the country's general election, and looks set to lose his parliamentary seat.
...
Mr Howard had found himself on the wrong side of public opinion on the Kyoto protocol and the war in Iraq, our correspondent said. Many people also seemed to be simply tired of Mr Howard after 11 years of his rule.
...
After too many years I can finally hold my head up and be proud to call myself Australian again 
Anne, Brisbane
...
31.
I rather liked the graphic scenario painted by Michael who was rightfully releasing some pent up disgust. I share his disgust.
I was able to picture this measly little group, who they might look like and who would be supporting a candidate hell bent on destroying the social structure of this country and what it is about.
32.
Sitka
Thu, 11/29/07
11:08 am
Reply to this
Then, my guess, you assume, expect, hope, await..., etc. it would be better in the hands of Democrats?!
That depends on the Democrats. Good ones are in short supply in DC these days, but that doesn't mean I'm going to start supporting Republicans.
---------
Yep...., there is always hope for a
- "good" tribal chief,
- "good" king/queen,
- "good" czar,
- "good" President,
- "good" General Secretary,
- "good" Government.
....
Is there end here?
Had to run some errands before the stores closed here, only to return to see that I have spazzed rd* out.
Sheesh, rd* chill ... you manifest some priggish traits, IMO ... and are definitely attributing powers to me that I do not have.
I will damn whomever I wish to Hell. That certainly doesn't mean that they'll go there.
But the odds on Hyde's going there are pretty damn good, totally apart from anything that I might say or do. If there is a Hell, that is.
Unless we take on entrenched interests in DC, we will not see a progressive agenda that includes universal health care, removes troops from the disaster in Iraq and transforms our energy/transportation systems to reverse global warming. It just won't happen. Edwards is speaking out directly on this need to stop the corrupt system in Washington that is supported by corporate Republicans and Democrats alike. Please watch this and understand:
31.
Indy Steve
Thu, 11/29/07
11:02 am
You are so right - when I was a young, thin chick I took looks for granted. Now that I'm old I see how much our looks affect how our way is made in life. There's a Code Pink lady here in town who is a big Kuchinich fan -- she says the whole reason he hasn't caught on is b/c of his looks.
Joan* In*Florida
Thu, 11/29/07
11:33 am
Really? I try not to judge people by their appearances or a negative association with a group. That is prejudice. And this piece is full of it. It is not acceptable, IMO, even when it's applied to a candidate's supporters who I don't support. They are people, just like you and me. And dismissing them as "fringe" is disgusting.
Before 9/11 -- when he was supposedly studying up on terrorism -- Rudy was really breaking up his (2nd) marriage via an affair with Judith Nathan (and hiding the charges in obscure agencies)
After 9/11 -- when he was supposedly stiff-arming state sponsors of terrorism -- Giuliani was really doing business (big money) with the oil Sheikh who protected and facilitated the 9/11 terrorists
With the money and contacts and prestige from that and other business, Giuliani runs a presidential campaign claiming he is a big-time pro on fightin' terrorism -- better than everyone else, particularly the Democrats
One has a hard time imagining Giuliani squirming out of sex and money and business ties to terrorism all at the same time, although I am sure he will try his darnedest.
Nonetheless, if you cup your hand behind your ear and turn towards Iowa, you can hear a faint, but distinct sound over the horizon: the flutter of Giuliani staffers mailing off their resumes to the Huckabee campaign.
Story with links to Village Voice, etc.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeffrey-feldman/giuliani-did-business-wit_b_74598.html
Annilow
Thu, 11/29/07
11:45 am
So true...some of the best people I know are "fringe" types. They are committed, principled people who are standing up for what they believe.
I happen to think DK is a much better Congressperson (how about Senator?) than he would be as President, but it has nothing to do with his looks.
17. Well, see, I would argue that corporations have become the tools of the power hungry.
On the other hand, the spouse says I'm sick.
http://www.infomaticsonline.co.uk/vnunet/news/2204527/al-gore-web-site-hacked
Spammers hack Al Gore's climate siteAttack shows interesting Google hacking technique
Iain Thomson, vnunet.com 28 Nov 2007Al Gore's Climate Crisis website has been hacked by spammers using an interesting technique to affect Google's rankings.
Hackers inserted links into the source code of the web pages of Gore's site.
These links were not visible to regular users as they were buried in the source code, but they were picked up by search engine software to affect the position of another site altogether.
"The fact that Al Gore's site got hacked or compromised, while definitely of significance, uncovers a much bigger technique now being used by spammers," said Vikram Thakur, of Symantec's security response team.
"The hackers were able to get to the top of the search results by creating links such as these. No one visiting the hacked site would have noticed or been affected by any malicious program. Not yet anyway."
Using this technique, and by posting comments on forums using an automatic generator, the team was able to move its bogus pharmaceuticals site up near the top of the search engine rankings.
Thakur fears that a vulnerability in WordPress web publishing software has left many bloggers open to attack by the same method.
"We have seen the spammers go from comment spamming to hacking WordPress, to injecting links, to getting top listing on the search engine results, to marketing pharmaceutical sites through a large network of interwoven links," he said.
...
47.
Monica Smith
Thu, 11/29/07
12:02 pm
....
On the other hand, the spouse says I'm sick.
---------
We all getting sick here...., but..."cure is on the way"..., lol.
Indy, it's not bigotry. It's an example of superficial judgment reinforcing prejudice. People make judgments about other people on the basis of how they "look." Somehow it hasn't sunk in that appearances are deceiving.
I expect that, in the long run, prejudice that inhibits behavior (prompts caution and circumspection) is probably more beneficial than not (from an evolutionary perspective). Which is why it persists.
Edwards is speaking out directly on this need to stop the corrupt system in Washington that is supported by corporate Republicans and Democrats alike.
According to his record in Washington, he's one of them.
- 1998-2002 Edwards supported the interests of the Center for Security Policy 50 percent
- 1999-2000 Edwards supported the interests of the CATO Institute--Center for Trade Policy Studies 40 percent
- 2000 Edwards supported the interests of the Family Research Council 50 percent
- 2001-2002 Edwards supported the interests of the American Land Rights Association 20 percent
- 2001-2002 Edwards supported the interests of the CATO Institute--Center for Trade Policy Studies 17 percent
- 2002 Edwards supported the interests of the Eagle Forum 33 percent
- 2002 Edwards supported the interests of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce 55 percent
- 2002 Edwards supported the interests of the American Coalition for Ethanol 100 percent
http://votesmart.org/issue_rating_category.php?can_id=2
Monica Smith
Thu, 11/29/07
12:13 pm
A distinction without a difference. Bigot = superficial judgment reinforcing prejudice. Call it what it is,
A bigot is a prejudiced person who is intolerant of opinions, lifestyles, or identities differing from his or her own.
Monica. I see your evolutionary point but I don't agree with an evolutionary view that bigotry and prejudice is helpful to our survival as individuals or as a society.
My point about bigotry in this blog piece is that you could substitute Dean for Ron Paul back in the early days of 03. That is exactly what was said of Dean "fringe" supporters.
Read the piece again with this in mind. It wasn't acceptable then to us and it's not acceptable now. DFA just seems to posting crapola these days. Do they even read this and discuss it BEFORE promoting it. It does represent DFA after all and should be discussed.
On evolution, since Monica brought it up. If we posit that everything in society that exists MUST be a result of some evolutionary (survival) need, isn't that a tautology?
That is, it exists therefore it must be essential to our survival. That could justify a lot of evil and prejudice, sexism and so on.
It is always dangerous to take a principle that is meant for natural systems and apply them to social systems. Just food for thought.
44. The reason Kucinich hasn't "caught on" is because he has no organizational ability, he's good at opposition, but not at creation, and he's incapable of capitalizing on his experiences.
Example: He's been married three times and still treats his wife as an object.
Example: He's a vegan and equates that with "animal rights." If the rest of organic or inorganic existance has "rights" why limit the concept to "animals?" Why not just go with don't kill what you don't need to survive?
Kucinich is another "my way, or the highway" person.
Sitka wrote: According to his record in Washington, he's one of them
If you listened to the Youtube video of Edwards (did you?) you would hear him admit as much. He is quite honest about going along some of the time.
That does not negate what he is saying and doing now however. People become aware of their actions, their prejudices and hopefully correct them.
Watch it again and see him talk about this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mco42ueX6fw
-
By Fox Mulder on Nov 29, 2007 9:02 AM ESTGood news!!! U.S. economic growth fastest in four yearsGDP for third quarter steamed ahead at revised 4.9 percent rate